Unranked Virginia 4ers with 200' Prominence

[wayfarer]

Hi John,

Thanks for this amazing resource!

Just wanting to know if it might be possible to add a few unranked, unnamed peaks to the Virginia 4ers list? A buddy (phlnph9) and I are working slowly but surely on bagging all the Virginia 4,000 Footers and we are using the same criteria as for many of the New England peakbagging lists - that is 200' of prominence. Counting the three 5ers, and a few 4ers in the "error range", and also Flat Top - which the National Park Service claims is 4,001', our list has 111 peaks on it, though it is certainly possible that we may have inadvertantly omitted more. I believe all of these 111 are on LOJ except for five. Any chance you would be willing to add these? Using your criteria of average elevations, they are:
1) 4300 on Garden Mountain, saddle at 4100, N37.0735 W81.4025
2) 4220 on Brumley Rim, saddle at 4010, N36.8250 W82.0790
3) 4100 on Garden Mountain, saddle at 3860, N37.0653 W81.335
4) 4057 on Shenandoah Mountain, saddle at 3820, N38.4352 W79.2753
5) 4060 on Garden Mountain, saddle at 3860, N37.0908 W81.2748 Another area just southwest is also at the same contour.

If you can do this, I will let you know if I discover any more.

Thanks,
Rick

P.S. - I am also fairly close to finishing all the Wythe County (my home), Virgina P200'+ peaks in LOJ, but I do not know if every peak between 200-299 feet prominence is in the database or not.

[John Kirk]

I can add those if there are unofficial names in print somewhere. This page explains the criteria for listing peaks that have less than 300' possible prominence:
http://listsofjohn.com/PeakStats/glossary.html

[wayfarer]

O.K. Thanks for clearing that up. So far as I know, none of these peaks have unofficial names. However, there a couple of nearby peaks to two of them with spot elevations and benchmarks named on the map that fall into the same error range for 200' prominence, and share the same saddles, and could actually be the highest. Would those qualify?

A contender to #2 is BM Clinch at 4,208' and the USGS map also says Clover Field. The WGS 84 coords for this one are N36.8291 W82.0793

A contender to #5 is BM Garden at 4,052'. Coords are N37.0761 W81.3097

Rick

[John Kirk]

Generally, benchmarks are referred to here when no other name exists and a summit exists on its own merits (i.e. prominence). There are some inconsistencies in CO's data where unranked benchmarks are listed. Other states have some unranked benchmarks listed, but only when they are HPs of the County or Most Prominent Points in the County. There are 25 of these of these in CO. I guess it would not be fair to allow these but not allow others in other states, but I don't want to open the floodgates and have requests to list every benchmark not in the LoJ database. Maybe it makes the most sense to delete the CO unranked benchmarks since they do not fit LoJ criteria. Comments are welcome...

[wayfarer]

I understand your reasoning and am ready to say O.K., leave it as it is. However, I personally do not think you should delete anything you already have in the database. Especially if it is a county high point or prominence point - though an unranked prominence point with less than 300' isn't much of a prominence point. Still, it is what it is, and deserves that recognition. Just my opinion.

I guess I am just somewhat married to the idea that 200' may make more sense in the Eastern U.S. to determine what qualifies as a separate peak. That is the criteria used for the Southern Sixers as well as for the 4,000 Footer lists in New England. Of course, in the Adirondacks, they use 300' or at least one mile away from a higher peak. Although it is obvious from studying the lists on LOJ that there really is no shortage of 300' prominence peaks in the east.

Thanks for considering,
Rick